Recent searches
Search options
Administered by:
This is how I ideally want companies to join the Fediverse: to start their own community servers.
A community server is something they control and manage.
A community server is expressly opt-in.
A community server does not stress volunteer admins.
Also, I’m now referring to instances as “community servers”.
Admins and devs might prefer “instances”, but this is confusing to everyone else.
What people need to know is that they can run their own community on a “server” that they control.
@atomicpoet @playdate @fediversenews @panic But it’s an _instance_ of a #Mastodon server. Not just any server. I get that you’re trying to simplify for mainstream consumption but I would argue that server, community or otherwise, is too generic for this case. Sometimes it may just make for sense to educate than simplify.
@antonioyon @atomicpoet @playdate @fediversenews @panic Ok, but aren’t web pages served by an _instance_ of a Web server? and email is facilitated thru _instances_ of Email servers, etc.? But they are never referred to that way. I like the Community Server idea, or just Mastodon Server or Mastodon Provider (like Email provider).
@provuejim @antonioyon @atomicpoet @playdate @fediversenews @panic
No one knows how email works, but everyone uses it.
No one knows how Twitter works, but everyone uses it.
"But oh gosh, I don't know how Mastodon works, I can't use it."
We need to make it transparent and obfuscate it from the normal public.
@Stark9837 @provuejim @antonioyon @atomicpoet @playdate @fediversenews @panic Most don't know how car works or change tires, but insist on driving. Heck,most is don't know how the body works, but we are living. This was the push back I used to receive for #EnThinnai.
@aswath @fediversenews @panic I guess part of the “problem” is that these type of new products are normally first adopted by technical early adopters and worked on from a deeply technical side.
Problem is here under quotes because it is not a really a problem more part of the product life cycle. Terminology will change over the next months to be more mass market friendly.
I am using the term product here in the loosest way possible.
@obale @aswath @fediversenews @panic
Saying "community" server though sortof suggests that it is restricted to that organisation's community. It makes it separate from the wider federation rather than making it an integrated part - an 'instance' - of the network.
@AlisonW @aswath @fediversenews @panic That is actually a very interesting perspective and thinking about it I tend to agree. It may give the same impression and confuse the situation more.
New users are missing the context and may misinterpret the meaning.
@obale @AlisonW @aswath @fediversenews @panic Not sure I agree. Lurking, then commenting on then joining various forums on the internet such as subreddits, forums, Discourse, Discord servers etc is pretty common on the internet.
Unless an instance were clearly for a real-life institution like a company, I feel like any “community” would easily feel inviting and something anyone can join or connect with.
@maegul @AlisonW @aswath @fediversenews @panic That is true. The question is if it conveys the fact that communities are not isolated and no matter what community server you originally join you can communicate and interact with all other ones. At least as long as they are not blocked.
Languages are always ambiguous, so there may be clarification need no matter how we are calling things. Once a term catches on and people are comfortable with it in this context that wouldn’t be a problem anymore.
@obale @fediversenews
Geocities used the word “neighbourhood”, but that’s not quite right either and probably triggers negative reactions from anyone who’s encountered their neighbours on Nextdoor.
“Community” could be either like a commune or a gated community. Both are possible in an anarchic Fediverse.
@MetalSamurai @obale @fediversenews
A neighborhood is an area, and a #community is a group of people. My neighborhood has a zip code, but I don't speak to everyone in the neighborhood, but I speak to my local community on the block.
An instance that is very big is a neighborhood. Smaller communities will always exist within. I only follow a few 100 people on my 75000 user #instance.
@Stark9837 @obale @fediversenews Either we make up new words, which sometimes goes well and people catch on quickly, but often causes confusion. Or we reuse existing ones and deal with the baggage and people’s (wrong) expectations.
Now is probably the time to decide on language with early adopters, but we may end up with another toot/post split. Anarchy. It’s cat herding. Or followers of the holy gourd vs holy sandal.
@maegul @obale @aswath @fediversenews @panic
But with the federated nature of Mastodon etc you only have to join _one_ space, not each individually.
@obale @aswath @fediversenews @panic
The other problem is that it is a weird one.
You get "What is #Mastodon" articles, but not "What is #Twitter" or "What is the water in your car for".
So people are intimidated. If they just thought it was "normal," they would be less confused. They overthink it.
I read ActivityPub's paper, front to back twice, and used the API docs to develop my bots. I need to know it. A normal user doesn't.
@Stark9837 @aswath @fediversenews @panic Completely agree. It is actually far simpler than it is framed . At least from an end-user perspective. Even the ActivityPub specification is not overall complicated for people that want or need to read it.
Once the Fediverse reaches critical mass I think that will change. It will go like that: “All my friends are here and most of them are on this community server so I just sign up there too”
@obale @Stark9837 @aswath @fediversenews @panic frustrated! How can I see the thread?
@jeffZA @obale @Stark9837 @fediversenews @panic This is one of the prob w AP federation. One sure way is to visit the author's instance. Some clients make it avial easily. If you are on the web int, click the three dots (Moe)in the post, select Open original page link. You may have to do at branches as well.
@aswath @obale @Stark9837 @fediversenews @panic Looks like #phanpy.social is a good solution.
@jeffZA @obale @Stark9837 @fediversenews @panic
Yes, it looks neat. I am planning to use it for the next few days.
@cheeaun
@jeffZA @obale @Stark9837 @fediversenews @panic
This is just a test post to see how the thread displays in #PhanpySocialDev
@aswath @jeffZA @obale @fediversenews @panic post a screenshot?
@Stark9837 @jeffZA @obale @fediversenews @panic Sorry for the delayed reponse. Couldn't figure out how to present the screen since the info is multiscreen. I suggest that you visit the two link side by side to appreciate the diff.
https://mastodon.social/@atomicpoet/109911489697198306
and https://phanpy.social/#/mastodon.social/s/109911489697198306
@Stark9837 @jeffZA @obale @fediversenews @panic
You will notice that posts are nested and shows in screen upto 3 levels. Need to go to another screen for the fourth level. Still it displays posts known by the local server; that means you can miss some of them if your server is not well connected. Probably @cheeaun can confirm it.
@aswath @cheeaun @jeffZA @Stark9837 @obale @panic
@aswath @cheeaun @Chartodon @jeffZA @obale @panic
@clacke @cheeaun @Chartodon @jeffZA @Stark9837 @obale @panic Nice idea & execution. Of course it can be enhanced & we all will have many suggestions. But the current one itself is a big improvement.
Since I have your attention, why all apps pull the msgs only from the home server? Why not pull the current msg & the metadata of the replies to that msg from ITS server and iterate? Does the protocol stop it? But a user can do this manually. Any clarification would help my understanding. TIA
On the other hand the app already relies on the Mastodon API when talking to the home server and several remote servers will happen to implement that API too, whether they're Mastodon, Pleroma, GoToSocial or Friendica.
When interacting with a remote post that isn't yet on the home server, the client would have to make sure to search-fetch the post to the home server first.
Maybe it would be helpful to implement some traversal method like this. Before implementing it, one would have to take care and consider how this would affect server load. Doing it en masse is probably a terrible idea, but it might be ok as a user-initiated action.
@cheeaun @Chartodon @jeffZA @Stark9837 @obale @panic
@Stark9837 @aswath @apps @jeffZA @obale @fediversenews @panic @cheeaun Toot! has the same thread UX. I like it. In fact Toot! has become my go to all around. Handles different local server feeds in an innovative way. #tootapp
@aethervision @Stark9837 @apps @jeffZA @obale @fediversenews @panic @cheeaun can you pls elaborate on the innovative way it habdles doff local server feeds? TIA
Will do once I've gone through everything. I've read the #Mastodon documentation a few times, so I want to give #Lemmy the same opportunity.
@aethervision @apps @jeffZA @obale @fediversenews @panic @cheeaun
@aswath @Stark9837 @apps @jeffZA @obale @fediversenews @panic @cheeaun Sure. I’ve attached 3 screenshots. The first is my “home” screen and feed via my main server, mastodon.social. The following shots show the view of journa.host and Techmeme.social through a local timeline view. You can boost and favourite when on screens 2 and 3 with the option of doing so in “home” account or local.
@aswath @Stark9837 @apps @jeffZA @obale @fediversenews @panic @cheeaun this is controlled via the thumb wheel in the lower right hand corner because why not just invent a new kind of UX.
@aswath @Stark9837 @apps @jeffZA @obale @fediversenews @panic @cheeaun And each instance can be styled separately so you know you’re not in Kansas anymore. Really strange but I like it.
That's some interesting #UI because #iphone developers are known to stricly conform to #apple UI patterns, but it looks interesting.
My experience, especially with all these #Mastodon apps on #Android, is that all the developers are doing completely different things except for all the forks of the official app like #Megalodon.
@Stark9837 @aswath @apps @jeffZA @obale @fediversenews @panic @cheeaun Breaks every damn rule but it works. It’s like the opening of the Simpson with the band, most app developers are working a somewhat similar line and then there this app like Lisa jamming like crazy and walking out of the room.
@aswath @apps @jeffZA @obale @fediversenews @panic @cheeaun
Are you using #android or #iphone? I had some weird instability bugs with it and came back to #Fedilab.
I've tested every single #Mastodon #app on #Android over the last 2 weeks. You should see my home screen on my phone, and also, naturally, I haven't disabled notifications, so every single app sends me notifications. It's just ridiculous, actually!
@Stark9837 @aswath @apps @jeffZA @obale @fediversenews @panic @cheeaun Thst sounds…fun. I’m on iOS. Sorry if that’s besides the point. The other interesting iOS app is Mona Beta. Doing really interesting things.
@aethervision @Stark9837 Both of you seem ti be evaluating diff apps. As you are continuing to do can you keep the following q. The current scheme of pulling posts only from the home server has a blind spot in that if it doesn't have visibility of a server, posts from that server will not be presented to the user. This is not good news for low user count instances. So any of the apps have any mitigation scheme?
I am not sure how the app pulls the content from these #instances. Because I would imagine with my #api key, the #app only has access to my #instance, and if that instance doesn't have a relay connected to the instance I am interested in, it won't work.
That being said, the instances I am following now are of people that I actually already follow, so I know there exists a connection. The loading time is, however, longer than normal.
@aethervision @Stark9837 I have a scheme: always pull the post and the metadata of its replies from it's home server and iterate. But the feedback I have received is that it is strictly for udden. Not sure why.
While developing my bot I only received the #api "forbidden" error if I accidentally tried to perform some action on another account's posts, or if I tried to #boost a post which was marked "mention-only" by the original sender.
So, how are you attempting to pull things? Otherwise, it is possible that the admins of the #instance are blocking such actions and only want to allow access through the #federated #timeline
@Stark9837 @aswath @apps @obale @fediversenews @panic @cheeaun how do I find @apps? It does t show on #apostore. Excuse #newbie
@provuejim @antonioyon @atomicpoet @playdate @fediversenews @panic
On that point though, so far as a user/viewer is concerned, a "web page" is served by a single¹ source to the whole world, not from their choice of server.
(¹ yes, there may be multiple actual sources depending on the site and geography but the user is not aware of this and doesn't make the choice)